They sorry

[himmelhorse 1,277]

2 hours ago, pmplayer said:

OK, what done is done and a lot of people will not be able to forgive but everyone deserves a second chance, so CS.

I agree totally with you but these guys are on the third, fourth or fifth chance. I have never had any of their products and have been very wary for the last 10 or so years.  Just too much negative surrounding them

Tony 

[himmelhorse 1,277]

58 minutes ago, Will Fly For Cheese said:

Captain Sin

Chock gets my first vote with "Corporal Sim"

Tony

[himmelhorse 1,277]

6 minutes ago, himmelhorse said:

Chock gets my first vote with "Corporal Sim"

Tony

Further to that,  If some one in the military pulled a stunt like this he would be almost instantly "Mr Sim"

I do not think many military services tolerate behaviour anything like this. They don't even like long hair LOL

Tony

[Dominique_K 10,156]

10 minutes ago, bobcat999 said:

It was in one of the long complaint threads on the official MSFS forum somewhere.  You will find it if you wade through the hundreds of comments on the CS B777 thread.

It was stated that a couple of the older developers (model makers) have departed, and there is someone left that just dabbles in a bit of xml now.

 

Yes, I  read that too. If it is true it is not a good news. Captain Sim has had its place in this industry. Their 777 for MFS is a bit strange considering their past history. They knew how to whip up good aircraft for a fair price, not top-tier but rather good. I had their 727 and C130. 

[bobcat999 8,571]

7 minutes ago, Dominique_K said:

Yes, I  read that too. If it is true it is not a good news. Captain Sim has had its place in this industry. Their 777 for MFS is a bit strange considering their past history. They knew how to whip up good aircraft for a fair price, not top-tier but rather good. I had their 727 and C130. 

Yes, I had lots of their stuff for FSX.  I loved their classic B737-200 for example and was satisfied with it. 

The fact that there have been no new models for quite some time now seems to point towards losing the capability. 

They were never what I would call a prolific developer, but there was always something going on, and if you look through the old back catalogue, there was quite a lot of work done there.  Even if it was not up to everyone's highest standard, I enjoyed a lot of it.

Edited May 24, 2021 by bobcat999

[pmplayer 9,817]

59 minutes ago, bobcat999 said:

Yes, I had lots of their stuff for FSX.  I loved their classic B737-200 for example and was satisfied with it. 

The fact that there have been no new models for quite some time now seems to point towards losing the capability. 

They were never what I would call a prolific developer, but there was always something going on, and if you look through the old back catalogue, there was quite a lot of work done there.  Even if it was not up to everyone's highest standard, I enjoyed a lot of it.

Me too, and they still have one of the best visuals you can get out there and on my older FSX times i had all products they offer at this time and was satisfied with that .

Shure not real study Level but some stuff wasen't far away and more than useable so i liked there work.

So i hope they stay in buisness and go on and hope we someday get all NEW overwoked stuff from the CS Team.

cheers 😉

[Chock 17,770]

I'm inclined to accept what they've said, not necessarily because I believe it is their heartfelt wish, I think they were just being pragmatic, but you become less than righteous yourself if you are unforgiving of other people's failings and so the benefit of doubt is the right thing to grant. But I'll regard them as 'being on close watch'; if this does genuinely prove to be a 'come to Jeezus' moment for them, then great, but they've now got a bit to do to regain the goodwill of the flight sim community and I can only hope that they will.

Like I said prior to all this malarkey, I have no problem with what they make and sell, it's up to the buyer to decide whether they want to enter the contract, it was the moving the goalposts after the deal was done and pushing people around that I objected to, and since they have retracted that behaviour, I'm back where I was with my opinion of them. 

I still think their Triple Seven, even considering what it is, which in fairness to them they were completely honest about, is a bit lazy in places and they do need to address that, but we do have to bear in mind that MSFS is a new ball game for every developer. This is why I was also prepared to accept a less than stellar effort from Virtualcol as their debut in MSFS with their Beech 99. 

Holding a grudge is not a good thing. Sometimes it can feel good to do it in the short term, but in the long run it can make you unnecessarily bitter about things when there are better and healthier ways to be. After all, these are toy planes we are talking about, although we also do have to keep in mind that we are also talking about making money as well, so it's not trivial in every respect.

I guess time will tell with CS, but for now at least, they are back in the light. We can be proud to have come together to force a good resolution to what would have been a very dark path to go down for both payware and freeware and I hope it's a lesson which was writ large for all developers. I know Avsim founder Tom would have been proud of how everyone stood up to this and firmly said 'no!', because it is exactly what he would have done and indeed did do when someone else tried it.

Edited May 24, 2021 by Chock

[andy1252 4,115]

Well, I bought it this morning, after the dust had settled a bit.

Yes, they are a pricey bunch with their "expansion packs" or whatever. Yes, this is just a skin over the 747. Yes, the guy acted like a megalomaniacal m0r0n with the repaints etc.

But . . .

I like their 777. I've bought lots of their stuff for the previous sims, mostly when they've had their sales on, and been very happy with it. I know what I'm buying, and you never know, they might patch it up better. If they bought their 707 over to MSFS, even if it were done the same way, I wouldn't hesitate to buy it in the absence of any alternative. And it's not like by buying from them I'm supporting a child molester or mass murderer - just an opportunistic bar steward with the normal dubious business ethics. Not that different to Microsoft, or indeed any other major corporation, bank, business etc. Sad but mostly true.

(but I must add I had to grab that "Captain Scam" repaint for it, nice bit of work)

cheers,

Andy

[mobeans10 200]

My personal favourite from CS forum;

Let's buy this awsome big twin engined fat girl.

P.D.: I'm expererimenting some troubles in the checkout. When I add to cart the product nothing is loaded in the cart.

😃

 

Edited May 24, 2021 by mobeans10
Spelling

[pmplayer 9,817]

41 minutes ago, andy1252 said:

Well, I bought it this morning, after the dust had settled a bit.

Yes, they are a pricey bunch with their "expansion packs" or whatever. Yes, this is just a skin over the 747. Yes, the guy acted like a megalomaniacal m0r0n with the repaints etc.

But . . .

I like their 777. I've bought lots of their stuff for the previous sims, mostly when they've had their sales on, and been very happy with it. I know what I'm buying, and you never know, they might patch it up better. If they bought their 707 over to MSFS, even if it were done the same way, I wouldn't hesitate to buy it in the absence of any alternative. And it's not like by buying from them I'm supporting a child molester or mass murderer - just an opportunistic bar steward with the normal dubious business ethics. Not that different to Microsoft, or indeed any other major corporation, bank, business etc. Sad but mostly true.

(but I must add I had to grab that "Captain Scam" repaint for it, nice bit of work)

cheers,

Andy

There are a lot mods out there for this one now and if u use them you feel as it flies a 777 and not a 747, shure not all is shining gold ( you even got the contrails now ) and also far from study level but for not all it have to be study level - to say i like SL can deal with that, at my old FSX days i had all PMDG Produkts and i still have a Flyengravity 747 Style CDU standing near me ( Version 1.05 bought around 2009 ) and hopefully in the future I can use it maybe again with PMDG and MSFS.

So in short to say the 777 now is working pretty fine and i would say after the upcoming Update a lot stuff will be fixed and is than more useable as now ..

I think a 777-300 is coming after that and i am lucky with the way it goes. 

cheers 😉

 

[kaosfere 3,115]

I was taught that there are three essential elements to an apology:

1. Acknowledgement.  ("I realize that I have caused you pain.")
2. Regret. ("I feel terrible that I have caused you this pain.")
3. Restitution ("How can I make it up to you?")

The "apology" post on their forum rings hollow on two of those.  ("We made a mistake" does not actually acknowledge the harm done: it could just as easily mean "we made a mistake and it has hurt us"; and "we're sorry" is an almost mechanical phrase; a genuine apology deserves more -- especially when you're not acknowledging the actual harm.)    And from what I can see, the third doesn't exist.

I will admit that it's better than the BS "I'm sorry you're offended" type of non-apology apology, in that it at least pretends to hit two of those points.    But it's not by much.  And the fact that they stood by their bad decision when it was questioned until the point where, seemingly, they felt they had no choice but to relent does nothing to help the situation.   Doing right under duress is not the same as doing right.

But, as Chock said, life is too short for grudges.  Personally, they've lost me as a customer until they manage to go a while without doing anything else asinine.  But I'm not going to sweat it, and unless there's a repeat performance they're not going on the eternal blacklist that one or two other developers have put themselves on with repeat offense.

Since they're not germane to this discussion, I'll avoid mentioning names there to keep this thread from drifting into debates that would probably get it locked. 😄

Edited May 24, 2021 by kaosfere

[Skywolf 992]

it is always about the Money.  Plain and simple

It is a business after all.

[bobcat999 8,571]

11 minutes ago, Skywolf said:

it is always about the Money.  Plain and simple

It is a business after all.

True in the main, but with some of the more conscientious developers out there, it is about being satisfied with your own product, and being delighted with the community finding enjoyment with it; and then the money is a welcome but well earned bonus after that.

Even Asobo is a business of course, but I do think the guys on the twitch feeds genuinely want to do good for the customers, and have a genuine interest in flight-simming and improving the sim, otherwise they would have thrown the towel in by now with some of the stick they have taken over some of the 'less enjoyable' updates!  😀

Edited May 24, 2021 by bobcat999

[styckx 1,872]

I hope FlightSim.To does the right thing and replies to Captain Sim with "New number who dis?" never acknowledges him again, and doesn't permit any CS repaints on their site again. 

[espent 1,534]

I don't think a "Sorry for all the mess" is enough to rescue this situation.

For the new generation of simmers that came in with MSFS and have seen nothing but openness among developers I think Captain Sims reputation is permanently destroyed. When you are so out of touch with your community and people have so many other options I don't see that they have a chance for a comeback. 

In a much smaller scale it reminds me of when someone tried to introduce European Super League. Some owners thought they could change football overnight, but underestimated the power of the supporters. 48 hours later the whole project was left in crumbles.

Edited May 24, 2021 by espent